I was invited by Max Haiven to speak to him and Aris Komporozos-Athanasiou on the podcast they host, The Order of Unmanageable Risks, an occasional research podcast about the crisis of anxiety in our society today and its links to the system of capitalism presented by the Common Anxieties Research Project. The focus of the interview was on the anxieties created by the deep knowledge among white people of the illegitimacy of white advantage drawing on the second chapter of my new book, Why Race Still Matters.